5.1 Junior chess issues and participation in world events like WYCC/WCCC/U16 Olympiad

[Nikolay Noritsyn]

That is assuming the coaches are happy with $500 for 2 weeks, which apparently is not the case. If each player has to pay $300 extra, a private coaching package for one tournament over the Internet is totally feasible.

May be an optional on-site coach for a nominal fee, say $100-$150?

I am predicting this year's junior financial will be in Red, we need to find ways to cut down the expenses and increase the revenue.

Just numbers. My work schedule in Uruguay:

8am-1:20pm, then lunch, then last minute preparation; round 3pm ~6 hours. work 6-10pm with dinner in between ~3 hours = 9 hours per day
9x50 (average coach fee nowadays. mine is 60) = 450 x ~9 days = 4050 (2 days are double round days, rest day I was working too)

As it is right now, CFC pays air fees ~1200 + 500 coach fee (should definitely be higher). Just from the numbers point of view - having a coach on-site is a definite positive.

[Victor Plotkin]

Just numbers. My work schedule in Uruguay:

8am-1:20pm, then lunch, then last minute preparation; round 3pm ~6 hours. work 6-10pm with dinner in between ~3 hours = 9 hours per day
9x50 (average coach fee nowadays. mine is 60) = 450 x ~9 days = 4050 (2 days are double round days, rest day I was working too)

As it is right now, CFC pays air fees ~1200 + 500 coach fee (should definitely be higher). Just from the numbers point of view - having a coach on-site is a definite positive.

I was a captain/coach 3 years ago in Hungary-2014 U-16 Olympiad and want to share some ideas about this tournament.

1. I agree with Nikolay: coach on site is very important. Once I asked E.Bareev (who gives lessons both on internet and face-to-face) to compare the efficiency. Eugene believes that on-line teaching has about 30% efficiency compare to face-to-face lessons. That means 3 times less eficient!! Maybe 30% is a very low number, I would say around 50%, but anyway the difference is huge.

2. U-16 Olympiad is a very interesting and usually well-organized event, so CFC should make some effort to send and support the strongest possible team. Unfortunately, in Canada juniors don't have enough experience it team tournaments. I remember, in USSR most of junior tournaments were team events.

3. Sometimes team of 4 is better than team of 5. According to regulations, one player must be a girl, but team of 4 boys-only is possible. In Canada we don't have too many competitive girls and sometimes the gap between board 4 and 5 is very significant (more than 300 rating points). In this case, a girl is less involved and feels not comfortable. My opinion - if the gap is too big - send team of 4. What is too big? Something like 150 points. In 2014, even Q.Zhou played just 6 out of 10 games and wasn't too happy.

[Vladimir Drkulec]

I was a captain/coach 3 years ago in Hungary-2014 U-16 Olympiad and want to share some ideas about this tournament.

1. I agree with Nikolay: coach on site is very important. Once I asked E.Bareev (who gives lessons both on internet and face-to-face) to compare the efficiency. Eugene believes that on-line teaching has about 30% efficiency compare to face-to-face lessons. That means 3 times less eficient!! Maybe 30% is a very low number, I would say around 50%, but anyway the difference is huge.

Those efficiencies are probably specific to Eugene. I actually find that online lessons can be more efficient than face to face because you don't have to reset the pieces and it is easier to backtrack to an earlier position without the inaccuracies of face to face where you usually use a chessboard. Also the elimination of travel time is a plus.

2. U-16 Olympiad is a very interesting and usually well-organized event, so CFC should make some effort to send and support the strongest possible team. Unfortunately, in Canada juniors don't have enough experience it team tournaments. I remember, in USSR most of junior tournaments were team events.

I agree. We went a little overboard with the Hungary U16 Olympiad but the results were satisfying from the point of view of team experience and participation. The only downside is that it created some expectations in certain individuals that we cannot repeat year after year.

3. Sometimes team of 4 is better than team of 5. According to regulations, one player must be a girl, but team of 4 boys-only is possible. In Canada we don't have too many competitive girls and sometimes the gap between board 4 and 5 is very significant (more than 300 rating points). In this case, a girl is less involved and feels not comfortable. My opinion - if the gap is too big - send team of 4. What is too big? Something like 150 points. In 2014, even Q.Zhou played just 6 out of 10 games and wasn't too happy.

According to the rules you must send a girl and she must play. In the instance where we did not send an onsite coach we had some issues with parents pushing the HOD not to play the girl even when the team they were facing was very bad. It would be better if they went to a national team and a girls team for this event instead of the current situation where we send a girl who plays less than her counterparts.

[Victor Plotkin]

Looks like you are right, Vlad. It was possible in 2014 to send 4 boys only. In 2017 even teams with 4 players (Belarus, Kyrgyzstan) have a girl. Probably, FIDE has changed the rules.

[Fred McKim]

I am in favour of increasing the cost for extra players on the WYCC/WCCC "Team"

For players who did not compete in the CYCC, but are allowed to participate by the Executive -$500
For players who did not finish in the top 3 in their section at the CYCC, but are allowed to participate by the CFC Executive - $250

[Fred McKim]

I am in favour of increasing the contribution form the YCC's to the Junior Fund, by an amount TBA

[Fred McKim]

I am in favour of doubling the Junior Rating fee to $1.00

[Michael Lo]

At many of these events the internet tends to be very spotty aside from times where everyone is asleep. We have done internet coaching also for the under 16 Olympiad in Mongolia a few years ago but that was coaching before and not so much during the event.

With the maturity of Internet in recent years, connections in major cities around the world should not be a problem. Most world class tournaments are being held in major cities. Most major wireless providers in Canada now offers travelling packages - $5 per day in US and $10 per day around the world, they partner with local providers to cover calls, texting and data. Players can either use the wifi provided by their accommodation and have the travelling package from their wireless provider as backup. That was what we did a few years ago, using the travelling package and our phone's tethering function to turn it into a wifi hot spot so that our laptop can be connect to the Intermat through the phone. Everything worked out fine.

Those efficiencies are probably specific to Eugene. I actually find that online lessons can be more efficient than face to face because you don't have to reset the pieces and it is easier to backtrack to an earlier position without the inaccuracies of face to face where you usually use a chessboard. Also the elimination of travel time is a plus.

We had been through 4 face-to-face coaches and 3 online coaches. I was there for most of the lessons and do not see a major difference in the quality and efficiency between them.

It may not be currently practical to totally eliminating on-site coaches, but a combination of on-site and online coaches can be considered to lower the cost. To the least, I believe it would make sense to send just one on-site coach to each of of the WYCC instead of sending two.

I am in favour of increasing the cost for extra players on the WYCC/WCCC "Team"
For players who did not compete in the CYCC, but are allowed to participate by the Executive -$500
For players who did not finish in the top 3 in their section at the CYCC, but are allowed to participate by the CFC Executive - $250

I am in favour of increasing the contribution form the YCC's to the Junior Fund, by an amount TBA

I am in favour of doubling the Junior Rating fee to $1.00

I definitely support finding ways to increase the revenue AND cutting down expenses for the junior fund, in order to balance the book. We should do a more detail financial analysis before jumping into making changes. The priority would probably try to make each junior event (WYCC WJCC, Olympiad U-16, etc.) self-sustainable, and then look into other source of income to support any events that are practically not self-sustainable.

It is already the last two days of this meeting; we should form a Youth Committee to carry on with the rest of the discussion on youth related topics.

[Vladimir Drkulec]

With the maturity of Internet in recent years, connections in major cities around the world should not be a problem. Most world class tournaments are being held in major cities. Most major wireless providers in Canada now offers travelling packages - $5 per day in US and $10 per day around the world, they partner with local providers to cover calls, texting and data. Players can either use the wifi provided by their accommodation and have the travelling package from their wireless provider as backup. That was what we did a few years ago, using the travelling package and our phone's tethering function to turn it into a wifi hot spot so that our laptop can be connect to the Intermat through the phone. Everything worked out fine.

The last few years generic internet at the hotels at world events has been poor. In reaction to this we did go for additional international internet packages to allow communication. It has made a difference.

We had been through 4 face-to-face coaches and 3 online coaches. I was there for most of the lessons and do not see a major difference in the quality and efficiency between them.

I have not noticed any difference in results for kids who take online lessons versus face to face. Internet lessons have a higher bandwidth of information because of the way you have to present them (chessbase versus a chessboard) allow for less time moving pieces around and more time teaching whatever you want to teach.

It may not be currently practical to totally eliminating on-site coaches, but a combination of on-site and online coaches can be considered to lower the cost. To the least, I believe it would make sense to send just one on-site coach to each of of the WYCC instead of sending two.

The first coach is relatively inexpensive if he is a FIDE trainer. We only have to pay travel and honorarium. It is the second coach that gets expensive as we also have to pay for hotel and food in addition to travel. It was just ten years ago that we did not send any coaches at all and the HOD was subsidized by the organizer of WYCC for food and hotel costs.

I definitely support finding ways to increase the revenue AND cutting down expenses for the junior fund, in order to balance the book. We should do a more detail financial analysis before jumping into making changes. The priority would probably try to make each junior event (WYCC WJCC, Olympiad U-16, etc.) self-sustainable, and then look into other source of income to support any events that are practically not self-sustainable.

It is already the last two days of this meeting; we should form a Youth Committee to carry on with the rest of the discussion on youth related topics.

At the moment, only the U16 Olympiad is not self sustainable. We use funds from CYCC to support the team.

[Michael Lo]

The first coach is relatively inexpensive if he is a FIDE trainer. We only have to pay travel and honorarium. It is the second coach that gets expensive as we also have to pay for hotel and food in addition to travel. It was just ten years ago that we did not send any coaches at all and the HOD was subsidized by the organizer of WYCC for food and hotel costs.

What if we only provide on-site coach for the 1st Place winners in each age group in the CYCC. The rest have to arrange for their own online coach on their own expenses. CFC can assist to align online coaches if they do not have one available, but will not pay for it. Is this a viable option?

At the moment, only the U16 Olympiad is not self sustainable. We use funds from CYCC to support the team.

I was alerted by the substantial increase in expenses after WYCC is split into WYCC & WCCC. If after the split, those events are still self-sustainable, and if we can restrict to send one on-site coach to each event, we should have enough funding to send one coach to the U16 Olympiad. Is that correct?