2005 WYCC in Belfort, France

[Hal Bond]

Some of you will recall the ghastly conditions provided for the 2005 WYCC in Belfort, France. As a result of this fiasco, FIDE banned the Organizer, Mr. Touze, from running FIDE events for 5 years. Mr. Touze appealed this decision to the Court of Arbitration for Sport in Lausanne.

The decision of the Court of Arbitration for Sport in Lausanne is attached in French and English at this link. It is unlikely that Mr. Touze will be permitted to organize anything for FIDE again.

http://www.fide.com/component/content/article/1-fide-news/4089-decision-of-cas-in-fide-v-j-p-touze-case

[Jonathan Berry]

Thanks for the link Hal. Very interesting read.

[...]

Article 63 and 64 are also gems for their contents.



I read articles 63 and 64 (but not any of the rest of the decision, aside from what Larry posted at Chesstalk), and they indicate that Touzé's case, or at least the part they are addressing, was without merit. Yet you indicate that Touzé won. Are you being sarcastic?

Call me a cynic, but the assignment of 80% of the costs to FIDE may indicate little more than a desire to recover the costs. I'm guessing that FIDE is more solvent, financially, than Touzé is.

I'd also be interested to hear more about Jean-Claude Templeur, who of course is the organizer and TD of the annual Cappelle-la-Grande extravaganza on the other side of France from Belfort. What role did he have in the Belfort debacle (not exactly débâcle)? His name was not mentioned in the linked document.

[Jonathan Berry]

I'm not sure what you refer to, but if you are talking about article 21,

I very very clearly stated that articles 63 and 64, the same ones you highlighted

"Article 63 and 64 are also gems for their contents."

paint a picture of Touzé's case, or a portion of it, being without merit. That pointed to your remarks being examples of sarcasm, considering the rest of your post. Now what should I call it? Trolling?

Much of the rest of the quoted message is trolling.

I have never met or corresponded with Templeur. I did notice on the Cappelle website that his wife was the webmaster and organizational contact, so perhaps I assumed too much by thinking that he had something to do with the organization. It is no secret that I admire the pairing system which Jean-Claude Templeur developed and uses at Cappelle. And that he uses a DOS-based program named ?? Merlin ?? to do those pairings. Other than that I know nothing about the Templeurs, and I know nothing about Touzé except that he was organizer of the horrible Belfort event.

The purpose of my questions was to figure out how Templeur, who has a close association with a 600-player tournament that runs year after year with apparent success, could be the bad guy in the failure of the World Youth in Belfort, on the other side of the country. So, yes, I do want to know, everything.

But you made me laugh about the FQE recognition before FIDE. I proposed that the CFC support the FQE's application, but I was the only governor in English speaking Canada to do so. No, I am not a Separatist, but I do think that would have been a Good Thing for everybody. And nobody can prove me wrong, because a couple of decades later, look at the CFC and the FQE! Both shadows of their former selves.


"article 21, I suggest you reread it again. "

JB: "I read articles 63 and 64 (but not any of the rest of the decision, aside from what Larry posted at Chesstalk), and they indicate that Touzé's case, or at least the part they are addressing, was without merit. Yet you indicate that Touzé won. Are you being sarcastic?"

&cetera.

[Valer Eugen Demian]

... is that even today quite a few members of the Canadian delegation have not received any money back after being over charged for the accomodation and meals.

CFC has been provided with sufficient proofs to make an official claim for refund (collective or individual) and I have promised in more than one ocassion if such refund would ever be received, I would donate my portion to CFC. Any news regarding this aspect should be of at least as much importance as this one!

Any chance to get an update on this subject Hal?

[John Coleman]

No, Cappelle-la-Grande is not "on the other side of the country from Belfort. In fact, it's on the "same side". Trolling ? Assuming I have the correct cities, one is on the north coast, and the other is near Switzerland, about 750km away.

Map: http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Cappelle-la-Grande+france&rls=com.microsoft:*:IE-SearchBox&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=&um=1&ie=UTF-8&split=0&ei=OvqPSr-aIofiMaPq2K8K&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1

[Jonathan Berry]

For more of Mr. Archambault's writing, see:

http://ajedrez_democratico.tripod.com/WPC-ACP-discussion.htm

and look for "Deathlock".

[Jonathan Berry]

Hey Jonathan

Yes Jean-Claude Templeur is the one who created the SAD with a software called Merlin (created by Alain Ribou, though) having the capability to use it. But he didn't create Merlin (you certainly are not to be bothered with such nuances, are you ?).

I only stated that Templeur uses Merlin, not that he wrote it. So where's the nuance?


You should know, I sent you a version Yes, by email 30 May 2003. Merlin 2.10 R3. I've never used it, as I don't have a Clé d'accès (password). I guess I could have followed the line on the bottom of the welcome screen:
COPYRIGHT 1985-2000 (c) ALAIN RIBOUS Tel: 01.[...]
to get a password, but never did. My mistake.


before you screwed up the 2003 CO in Kap. with something similar to it (that you didn't seem to understand very well, if I may).
Charming. The gentle reader who is patient and has lots of time can check this document:
http://members.shaw.ca/berry5868/kapn.htm
to judge how well I understood SAD, or whether it was not important because I was doing something different. Ray Kerr's contribution was just as valuable to the system, IMO.


However Jean-Claude made substantial modifications to it in recent years and I'm not convinced anymore it's so good.
Well, there we go.


No, Cappelle-la-Grande is not "on the other side of the country from Belfort. In fact, it's on the "same side". Trolling ?
As John Coleman pointed out, one is near Belgium and the Strait of Dover, the other is near Germany and Switzerland. If France is a pentagon, Cappelle is shy of apex A, while Belfort is beyond apex B. Belfort is less than 20 miles from the Swiss border, Cappelle is less than 5 miles from the sea. The distance as the crow flies is only about 375 miles. The purpose of my questions was to figure out how Templeur, who has a close association with a 600-player tournament that runs year after year with apparent success, could be the bad guy in the failure of the World Youth in Belfort, on the other side of the country.



I'm certainly not the one who made innuendos on Touzé's financial status (over even FIDE's for that matter). Where you trolling again ?

AND

Rumor (unconfirmed of course) as it that the 2005 WYCC organizers lost money with the event. So I'm not sure who you could sue. Just don't hold your breath for too long.
Nothing personal about Touzé. After all, I've never met him! I just figured that anybody for whom organizing FIDE-rated chess events was a central part of his income, couldn't be a wealthy person. Perhaps you agree.



When you say: "And nobody can prove me wrong, because a couple of decades later, look at the CFC and the FQE!" are you trolling once more ? Has trolling became one of your favorite hobby ? The CFC might be going down the drain as we speak, but the FQE is by no mean anywhere close to that. In fact, it's financial situation is quite comfortable as we speak.

How many members does the FQE have?



You know Jonathan, if you don't know much about something like CAS, the FQE or anything else, there is no shame in saying so. You're getting old Jonathan.

And you're not! Ah, the bitter dregs, my young friend, that we have both drawn an unlucky card from the deck of Time. Time for another draught.