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Thread: Something To Think About

  1. #11

    Default Club Tournaments - Handing in Score Sheets: Voluntary or Mandatory?

    Update:

    For our SCC club championship section, handing in of the carbon score sheets is " voluntary " ( it is a 10-player round robin of 6 masters, 3 experts and 1 A Class player ). We collect games into our SCC Games Database that we have collected for a few years now and then give the games back to the members.

    Now one player in the championship section has formally given notice to the club that he refuses to hand in his score sheet ( which he has a right to do ). He feels it is an unfair playing field if he cooperates with the club and voluntarily hands it in, when other players are refusing to hand their games in. They will have games to prepare against him, and he will have no games to use to prepare against them.

    He also states that he understands that the club members would like the championship games to play over, for both enjoyment and learning. He would be quite happy to do this if ALL players handed in games ie. the policy was "mandatory ". But as long as it is " voluntary " he refuses.

    What do you think of his position?

    Should SCC change the policy to make handing in the carbons " mandatory "?

    Bob

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
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    Default

    Bob, what is a slogan of your club? smth about friendly club, yeah?
    Now, is it a friendly behavior of your members? Thus if >50% friends think that there are more benefits to have scoresheets in the database, other <50% should be convinced that it is good for friendship
    .*-1

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    1,313

    Wink Wait till the end of the tournament !

    Bob,

    Maybe you should compromise and not make any games public until the tournament is finished. That would level the playing field a little.

    Of course, hopefully they realize that any further control (censorship) of games would be futile. Your club members have lots of games in the public domain on your newsletter alone, not to mention chessbase.

    When I was at Canadian Open 2005 in Edmonton, I was quite astonished to learn from my opponent after the game that he had prepared against me the night before by "chessbasing" me. Unfortunately for him, I had abandoned that line I played in Bermuda a year earlier. Nevertheless, I was quite proud of myself that he had bothered to prepare given he was much higher rated.

    Now I would like to report I won that game, but I would be lying !

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
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    Kitchener, ON
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    Default

    Wasn't there also a compromise in an earlier Women's Closed where the games were not made public for a few months until after it finished, to maintain secrecy for the Olympiad? Was a couple of years ago I think.

  5. #15

    Default Something to think about

    Thank you for your most entertaining opinions!! I mean really, in the day and age when the strongest tournaments report their games live on the net and the games are annotated as well, for all to see around the world, you think of keeping secret the monumental games of your tournaments? You are kidding, right?
    But just in case you are not, the train to Gagra is leaving tomorrow.

    Cheers
    Peter

  6. #16

    Default

    Thanks for bringing some perspective to the discussion, Peter.

  7. #17

    Default Club Tournaments - Handing in Score Sheets: Voluntary or Mandatory?

    Hi Peter & Ken:

    We are not trying to keep our " monumental " games secret - and for your information, at a club level, having 6 masters, 3 experts and 1 A player in a round robin is very strong, as far as I am aware. Are you aware of a stronger club championship in Canada?

    In fact, our goal has been to make our club games public. We collect all the games members will give in to us ( it is voluntary ). A volunteer club member takes the time to enter all these games into a database to give back to members each week. And the database is sent to Hugh Brodie for inclusion in the CanBase. Please advise me of another club that goes to this trouble to make their games public !

    The issue is one of a level playing field. Because the handing in of games is voluntary, some players in the championship section are handing them in, and others are not. So each week the players get the database with the games of those who are cooperating with the club. So, the games of some are available for others to prepare against them, while there can be no preparation against those not handing in their games. One player has rightly raised that this is unfair and is refusing to hand in his games, and to have them put into the weekly database, UNTIL THE HANDING IN OF GAMES IS " MANDATORY ", not " voluntary " ie. until all games are handed in and go into the database for all players to use.

    What do we do?

    Some here on the CFC Chess Forum, including CFC ED Bob Gillanders, have proposed a compromise. Take players' games on a " voluntary " basis, but SUSPEND entering them into the weekly database temporarily - ie. until the tournament is over. That way SCC gets the games it wants, for all Canadians, and the world ( we're not too proud of them ) to see, play over and enjoy, and learn from, and at the same time, no player in the championship will get an unfair advantage over the other.

    I have proposed Bob's solution to the SCC Executive, and it is acceptable to the championship player raising the voluntary/mandatory issue.

    I'll keep you posted ( since I know you are waiting with bated breath ).

    Bob

  8. #18

    Default Something to think about

    Hi Bob,
    You raise a good point, the playing field has to be level. So the solution might be to pick a date, any date, and let the club members vote on it, spelling out what voluntary means.
    The more drastic step would be to make the handing in of score sheets mandatory from a future date onward, either at the end of each round or at the end of each tournament.

    Cheers
    Peter

  9. #19

    Default Club Tournaments - Handing in Score Sheets: Voluntary or Mandatory?

    Hi Peter:

    Thanks for your continuing input.

    The executive are continuing to wrestle with this one which pits the individual member's right to keep his game private, vs the opponent's right to make it public, and where the club membership comes in in their desire to have the games available to enjoy and play over.

    Difficult issues. I'll let you know what the exec. finally decides.

    Bob

  10. #20

    Default

    A player does not have a right to keep a game private when played in a tournament. The scoresheets belong to the organizers.

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