10B. CYCC Free Entries (Felix Dumont / Edward Porper)

[Félix Dumont]

Also, this year's CYCC is heading for over 260 participants.
This means that the organizer will have $20 000 plus all the money from sponsors to cover its expenses* . I hardly see how we can't fit $3000 in that to make it a true national championship.


*i.e. Canadian Open

[Michael Barron]

Unfortunately Felix Dumont has his facts wrong...
Les Bunning

Les, you could easily prove it - please post your budget here.
It's not a secret, isn't it?

[Les Bunning]

My understanding is that the winners get $1000 towards travel to the WYCC plus designation as official representatives which entitles them to free accommodation and food in normal years. This year everyone gets free accommodation and food at the WYCC from the United Arab Emirates hosts.

Last years event may have only contributed $1000, this was because it was the only bid and the governors accepted the bid instead of insisting on the usual rules which say that $150 of the entry fee is to fund the cost of travel to the WYCC. We are confident that the $150 per player that we are collecting and will be given to the CFC will be sufficient to pay travel for the whole team especially as the airfare for that time period from Toronto is approximately $1500 per person. About a year ago I chaired a committee which looked into this whole matter. Perhaps somebody with grater technical skills than I can find this report and post it here.
Les Bunning
Les Bunning

[Félix Dumont]

The FQE has some discounts for flights, so when it was time to decide between sending kids to the NAYCC or the WYCC, we went to our travel agency (non-profit organization) and asked them how much the flight would cost at that time of the year. Their answer was that it would cost between $3000 and $4000 if booked in advanced, but could be more expensive at the last minute. There are some ways to save money by having stops in Africa then taking a cheap flight with an unknown company (and for a total time of about 30 hours), but I wouldn't recommend that for kids.

I would be really extremely happy to be wrong, but a quick glance on Expedia and many companies seem to confirm this (actually most flights cost between $4000 and $5000).

[Les Bunning]

The FQE has some discounts for flights, so when it was time to decide between sending kids to the NAYCC or the WYCC, we went to our travel agency (non-profit organization) and asked them how much the flight would cost at that time of the year. Their answer was that it would cost between $3000 and $4000 if booked in advanced, but could be more expensive at the last minute. There are some ways to save money by having stops in Africa then taking a cheap flight with an unknown company (and for a total time of about 30 hours), but I wouldn't recommend that for kids.

I would be really extremely happy to be wrong, but a quick glance on Expedia and many companies seem to confirm this (actually most flights cost between $4000 and $5000).

The WYCC is being held in Al AIN U.A.R. which is about 60 miles from Dubai. It is being held Dec17 to Dec 29. Expedia .ca shows the current airfare from Toronto to Dubai , by British Airways changing in London England , leaving Toronto Dec 15 and returning from Dubai on Dec 30 as $1,086 return.
Les Bunning

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

I am unclear why it was necessary to say the President and Secretary should take of motions. After all the President has the right (subject to appeal) to rule any motion in or out of order as well as to certify whether a motion is or is not a constitutional amendment while the Secretary posts all motions received and conducts the vote. Beyond that I routinely e-mail the President when I am doubtful about whether a motion is in/out of order or a constitutional change usually giving my recommendation which by no means is always followed.

Seems to me that if you support the intent of a particular motion you vote FOR it and if you don't then you vote AGAINST it.

To me I'm stating the obvious and thus I'm confused about Mr. Z's point.

It was my answer to the F.D. question: "...but I don't know what happenned with it. ". and I assumed that the F.D. question was due to lack of any response from President/Sectretary smth like "thnx, we noted your motion".

[Ellen Nadeau]

I believe it is detrimental to organizers to force offering free entry and lodging to previous champions. It can be difficult to get organizers on board already and these motions may make it harder. As Félix, I believe it is imperative to put all monies raised at CYCC back into youth chess(WYCC, Youth fund...)
Ellen

[Christopher Mallon]

There is no way here to make one rule that can apply equally well to all possible situations.

The current rule is, in my opinion, a fine balance between protecting the CFC/Champions and protecting the organizer.

So what if it happens once in a while that some of the CYCC entry fees get spent on an attached event. The organizer would be within their rights to just pay themselves that money, would you prefer they did that? The same rule that allows them to do that allows a smaller or more out-of-the-way city to actually have a chance at running a CYCC without a massive potential loss.

[Félix Dumont]

There is no way here to make one rule that can apply equally well to all possible situations.

The current rule is, in my opinion, a fine balance between protecting the CFC/Champions and protecting the organizer.

So what if it happens once in a while that some of the CYCC entry fees get spent on an attached event. The organizer would be within their rights to just pay themselves that money, would you prefer they did that? The same rule that allows them to do that allows a smaller or more out-of-the-way city to actually have a chance at running a CYCC without a massive potential loss.

What I prefer is to have honest organizers that care about the youth. Obviously, some organizers could keep the surplus as a salary, but this is even worse.
How much does it cost to run a 6 rounds CYCC? $6000? $10 000 if we are really generous? Now, this means that at least $10 000 will disappear from youth chess. This money would have been enough to launch a national coaching program! Instead what? It's used to pay foreign GMs. Yes, it could have been worse. But it's still incredibly frustrating for those who actually try to help the youth.

More than how much the WYCC costs or how many rounds the CYCC has, this is the real problem at this point. Kids are used to make money so other tournaments can be organized. And after that people wonder why we have so much troubles having a decent youth program.

I understand the lodging can be hard. But there's no way organizers can't even afford free entry fees for winners (most of which wouldn't have participated anyway!). By the way, the motion was indeed separated into two different motions (entry fees and lodging).

[Les Bunning]

$150 of each entry fee goes to the CFC to finance the team to the WYCC. $75 goes to the organisers to run the event. Of this $75 about $25 is our cost for each competitor who will each receive a Tee shirt and a commemerative medal. There will be medals for the top 3 players in each category and a trophy for the winner in each category. Our break even point is about 200 players. Based on current enrollment we expect to receive about 250 players. This will give us a surplus of approximately $2,500. We may be able to spend this on additional events at the CYCC but if not we will decide what to do with it after the event is over. In 2007 when we had substantial sponsorship $ we gave over $40,000 to the CFC youth program. Unfortunately this year there is very little sponsorship money.
Les Bunning