30. Motion 2011-E - DISCUSSION

[Lyle Craver]

I'm generally in favor of this one since most Governors have online access, and most communities have public machines in their public libraries which would accomodate those who don't.

I'm NOT in favor of extending this to AGMs at this point as we are discussing changes and it's not yet clear what these shall be. So until we do it's best not to make too many changes.

[Bob Gillanders]

IMHO, this one is a no brainer. Simply put, we keep proxy votes for the AGM in July, but no proxy votes for the other quarterly online meetings in October, January, and April. Everyone has access to a computer (with a little effort), so there is no need for proxies for online meetings.

IMHO, this is a constitutional item due to the nature of it (ie. amending voting rights) irregardless of where it is in the handbook or whatever other legal arguments you may present. Thank God I am not a lawyer, and I have no interest in debating this!

Can we please pass this no brainer by a wide margin and avoid the whole debate whether it is constitutional or not.

[Christopher Mallon]

No brainer yes, and I hope one day we can do away with AGM proxies as well, once the AGM is at least partially held online or with online access.

[Francisco Cabanas]

While I agree with the spirit of this motion, proxies have no place in an online meeting, the wording is far too restrictive. I propose the following as an amendment:

That Rules and Regulations, s. 21, Proxies, be amended by adding after the words

“21. Any Governor who is unable to be personally present at a meeting of the Assembly may appoint any person to act as his proxy.”

the following sentence:

“Proxies are not applicable to a meeting of the governors that is conducted entirely online and over the Internet. – this is directed, beyond generally, at Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a ). “

The argument here is that the President may in the future call a special meeting online to deal with a particularly controversial issue, so we would have the situation where proxies were allowed in that very controversial issue where the potential of abuse was greatest. Also what happens if we decide to change the frequency of our online meetings at a future date? This of course would not apply to an AGM that had both in person and online participants.

By the way should my amendment fail I do still support the original motion.

[Bob Armstrong]

Hi Francisco:

For comparision:

Our addition in Motion 2011-E : " Proxies are not applicable to the non-AGM quarterly governors’ on-line meetings – this is directed, beyond generally, at Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a ). "

Your proposed amendment substitution : “Proxies are not applicable to a meeting of the governors that is conducted entirely online and over the Internet. – this is directed, beyond generally, at Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a ). “

Your argument is that there may be meetings other than just the AGM and " the non-AGM quarterly governors’ on-line meetings ", and the section will not speak to those meetings under the motion amendment.

Seems reasonable to me. If you bring the necessary amending motion, I will vote for it. I note that already, the AGM Modernization Subcommittee is proposing that the Spring 2011 ( April ) Quarterly Meeting, not be on-line, like the first three, but that it be changed to a model like the AGM one - some on-site governors, and the rest attending via internet ( will be a " free " trial run of the proposed modernization of the July AGM from the web corporation selling their conference meeting format ). So you are right that new meetings, and new formats for meetings should be anticipated in the amendment.

Thanks.

Bob

[Francisco Cabanas]

Thanks Bob for your support. I am prepared to present the following motion: That motion 2010-E be amended to read:

That Rules and Regulations, s. 21, Proxies, be amended by adding after the words

“21. Any Governor who is unable to be personally present at a meeting of the Assembly may appoint any person to act as his proxy.”

the following sentence:

“Proxies are not applicable to a meeting of the governors that is conducted entirely online and over the Internet. – this is directed, beyond generally, at Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a ). “

[Bob Armstrong]

Hi Francisco:

Your motion seems good. I'll vote for it when it comes up.

You need though to still find a seconder, and then you need to engage Lyle, as meeting Posting Secretary, in creating a new thread for you with the Amending Motion. He has a special way he likes to deal with motions amending a motion on the floor.

Also, I believe Bob G has decided not to use the Board voting format, although he has not yet confirmed this. And I don't know if Chris has yet altered the Board voting format to disengage the " view results " option BEFORE voting, if it is used. I think Bob G wants to vote by e-mail this meeting. You will need to clarify this with Bob G and Lyle.

Bob

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

I would second Mr. Cabanos wording of this motion if the part "– this is directed, beyond generally, at Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a ). " is deleted.

The clause is about PROXIES, and not about online meetings (aka Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a )). What is "s."? (Such abbreviation is not defined in the Handbook.)

[Bob Armstrong]

Hi Egis and Francisco:

If Francisco accepts Egis' amendment to his motion, I will not vote for it then. The whole problem has been Lyle's determination initially to interpret s.3 (a) as somehow fudging the issue of Proxies - it was due to Lyle's original position that Fred and I felt it necessary to bring our motion 2011-E in the first place. However, Lyle now seems agreeable to motion 2011-E as originally framed, and accepts that no proxies makes sense. But I still want the reference to s. 3 ( a ) left in for this particular reason.

( " s. " is usually used conventionally as the short form for " section " )

Bob

[Francisco Cabanas]

I would second Mr. Cabanos wording of this motion if the part "– this is directed, beyond generally, at Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a ). " is deleted.

The clause is about PROXIES, and not about online meetings (aka Bylaw # 3, s. 3 ( a )). What is "s."? (Such abbreviation is not defined in the Handbook.)

I am fine with the change as it makes the wording much better. The amendment now reads:

Moved Francisco Cabanas, Seconded Egidijus Zeromskis, That motion 2010-E be amended to read:

That Rules and Regulations, s. 21, Proxies, be amended by adding after the words

“21. Any Governor who is unable to be personally present at a meeting of the Assembly may appoint any person to act as his proxy.”

the following sentence:

“Proxies are not applicable to a meeting of the governors that is conducted entirely online and over the Internet."