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View Full Version : 5B4 - NEW MOTIONS - Olympic Team Selection (Moved Victor Plotkin,Seconded Fred McKim)



Lyle Craver
11-18-2016, 10:51 PM
Motion 5B4. Motion #4. Bonuses/penalties for the last Canadian Closed and Canadian Women.

Bonuses/penalties for performance in the last Canadian Closed or last Canadian Women, respectively, that took place 5-36 months prior to the Olympiad and that has not been used as qualification for a previous Olympiad:

+20 points for 2nd place
+10 points for 3rd place
-10 points if the player did not participate or withdrew.

This bonus/penalty will be added/subtracted to any base rating number (last rating, average rating or highest rating).

Garland Best
11-21-2016, 10:03 PM
What is the motivation for this portion?

Is it fair to penalize players who could not participate in the closed events? They might be unable to due to travel costs, school or work commitments, etc. I might go for the carrot, but i don't approve of the stick.

Pierre Dénommée
11-21-2016, 11:05 PM
What is the motivation for this portion?

Is it fair to penalize players who could not participate in the closed events? They might be unable to due to travel costs, school or work commitments, etc. I might go for the carrot, but i don't approve of the stick.

It is hard to convince players to take part in the Canadian Closed. It is our most prestigious tournament, with Zonal status when it qualifies for the World event. We should strive to increase participation and giving a spot on the team is a step in the right direction.

Victor Plotkin
11-21-2016, 11:06 PM
Motivation for this motion is to increase the value of Canadian Closed. In many countries, players have to play in specific tournament (like national championship) to qualify for the Olympiad Team. Small penalty of 10 rating points does not eliminate chances to qualify even if a player did not play in the Closed.

The carrot for one player is the stick for another one. We can change the wording:

+10 points if player played all rounds of Canadian Closed
+20 points for third place
+30 points for second place

However, it's exactly the same.

Michael Barron
11-22-2016, 03:16 PM
Motivation for this motion is to increase the value of Canadian Closed. In many countries, players have to play in specific tournament (like national championship) to qualify for the Olympiad Team. Small penalty of 10 rating points does not eliminate chances to qualify even if a player did not play in the Closed.

The carrot for one player is the stick for another one. We can change the wording:

+10 points if player played all rounds of Canadian Closed
+20 points for third place
+30 points for second place

However, it's exactly the same.

Yes, it's exactly the same.
But I like this wording better... :)

Valer Eugen Demian
11-23-2016, 04:51 PM
Again, how big is the pool of players likely to be considered for our Olympic teams? How would a team of players ranked 5th to 9th by strength fare compared with the best available team? It is fine to look for performance, but let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater...

Victor Plotkin
11-23-2016, 05:14 PM
Trust me, my only goal is to send the best available team. No matter who the captain is.

Team of players ranked from 5 to 9 is definitely not the best team. However, a 2500 players can not surpass Bareev or Kovalyov with all bonuses together.

Traditionally, we give a spot to the champion (the winner of the Canadian Closed). In some cases, like this year, it means the bonus of more than 100 points. If the winner gets more than 100 points is it logical to grant 20 points for the 2nd place and 10 points for the 3rd place?

Valer Eugen Demian
11-23-2016, 05:21 PM
Trust me, my only goal is to send the best available team. No matter who the captain is.

Team of players ranked from 5 to 9 is definitely not the best team. However, a 2500 players can not surpass Bareev or Kovalyov with all bonuses together.

Traditionally, we give a spot to the champion (the winner of the Canadian Closed). In some cases, like this year, it means the bonus of more than 100 points. If the winner gets more than 100 points is it logical to grant 20 points for the 2nd place and 10 points for the 3rd place?

OK, so then how does this rule really help with the selection? What range of ratings are affected and also what range is not affected? This could give a better picture (at least to me) of how this rule is supposed to work. Thanks in advance! :)

Victor Plotkin
11-23-2016, 05:33 PM
On the previous on-line governor's meeting I gave an example, how the proposed system would have affected the team selection in 2010, 2012, 2014 and 2016. You can find it.

I remember the results. In 2010 Hansen would have been selected instead of Samsonkin. In 2012 no change. In 2014 Noritsyn would have been selected instead of Hambleton.
In 2016 Sambuev would have been selected instead of LeSiege.

Interesting, every player who missed the team is higher rated now than the player who was selected in reality. Hansen is almost 200 points above Samsonkin, Noritsyn is above Hambleton.

Based on last 4 campaigns, the proposed system would have worked well.